Looking at Budget PC build for Hitfilm (Under $700)

alaska_vfx_filmeralaska_vfx_filmer Website User Posts: 443 Enthusiast
edited February 12 in Practical Filmmaking

HI All, I have recently been looking for a PC or laptop worthy of my hitfilm pro humble bundle deal, and while I know little about computers in general, I know you get more bang for buck and flexebility in the diy pc world than in laptops, at this time I'm really not wanting to spend anywhere from 1-10k on what is at this point a small hobby, looking around I found this video  How would this build preform with Hitfilm?  Some 3d stuff, some compositing etc, no 3 hour project renders. 

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Comments

  • kevin_nkevin_n Website User Posts: 1,758 Enthusiast
    edited February 5

    Before I continue, the difference between short projects and long projects is time. The performance you get out of your machine in both will be linear.

    Are you buying in the US or somewhere else?

    Some parts are outdated but not by much, the GPU and RAM are still 'best value' although deals is generally the deciding factor not MSRP's or price of those when that video was posted. I will put together a list on PC partpicker as a point of comparison and edit this thread when I'm done. It's my preferred way to do this.

    The future proof-ness of that motherboard isn't true. All motherboards of AM4 are future proof if AMD continues to release socket compatible CPU's for that chipset. They will likely stop soon because AM4 is starting to show limitations and given their keynotes recently they'll want to move on to possibly AM5, but of course I'm just guessing on the name. Now, what matters with compatibility up until this point is the BIOS, if the manufacturers provide BIOS updates supporting 3x Ryzens then you're good to go. Not all do, and consulting the manuals before buying would be ideal to avoid headaches of having to buy a second low power CPU just to updated the BIOS to then return it afterwards, or have it not run 3x CPU's at all...

    And lastly as for the Molex adapter, seems completely pointless to me, and waiting for a fire to happen. I've used many different kinds of molex brands and on one in our own office, we witnessed the PC trying to create it's own VFX as it was spewing sparks out the cable itself. It looked just like a lightning strike hitting a house electrical with no grounding and sparks starts flying out through the sockets. I personally can't recommend any third party power supply components, but they shouldn't be necessary anyways if the PSU is actually worth it's money, everything you need and more, will be included already.

  • alaska_vfx_filmeralaska_vfx_filmer Website User Posts: 443 Enthusiast

    @CNK thanks for the prompt reply, I'm in Alaska, so sort of in the US for buying and shipping purposes ;-)

    So I'm hearing "gpu, ram ok, cpu and motherboard, not if you want to upgrade in the  future, molex power adapter NO". If I went with this build (or a variant)  I would have to be putting it in a mobile case for portability, because I don't actually have room for a desktop (yes I know it's a funky idea with complications like ssd only, secure everything, vent like crazy, don't throw it, etc), 

    Sorry, but were saying the psu is not a good bet, or just the adapter?

  • kevin_nkevin_n Website User Posts: 1,758 Enthusiast

    How big would this case have to be? It changes everything so need to know before anything else.

  • alaska_vfx_filmeralaska_vfx_filmer Website User Posts: 443 Enthusiast

    I could get anything from a suitcase to a lunchbox :-)

    BTW  thanks for the help.

  • alaska_vfx_filmeralaska_vfx_filmer Website User Posts: 443 Enthusiast
    edited February 8

     From the Laptop thread





    ''... I'm gonna be frank. Id rather have a desktop and just remote in from a low spec laptop instead of buying a low spec laptop and no desktop. The cases have gotten quite small and some can even house full size graphics cards with the help from PCI-e adapters which angle the card flat. A mate of mine is running a i5 (6c) with a GTX 1650 with no heat issues whatsoever. Id have to ask what case he's using. But they're getting increasingly popular and mini ITX form factor is rather easy to come by with plenty of options to choose from. A mini ITX case is not much bigger than a Xbox console. But you could look them up as dimensions vary greatly!''

     

    So Ill scrap the idea of a laptop (or at least that laptop) for now.

     



  • alaska_vfx_filmeralaska_vfx_filmer Website User Posts: 443 Enthusiast

    Just checked amazon pricing for above build, Not including the case, it comes to $555.00, it would be a bit more for me (somehow Alaska isn't part of the continental United States so they wont ship some stuff to me ).

    just to verify, were you recommending NOT getting that particular cpu and motherboard? or just warning me?

  • kevin_nkevin_n Website User Posts: 1,758 Enthusiast
    edited February 8

    "just to verify, were you recommending NOT getting that particular cpu and motherboard? or just warning me?"

    Neither because of the current sale of that CPU. Otherwise, the 3rd gen would be the way to go had they both been MSRP. :)

    Its a competent CPU and right now its a steal at $120. 

    Heres some different specced options using the Node 202 case - about the size of an Xbox One, dimensions checked, everything is compatible:

    ---------------------------------------------------
    #1.
    No compromise:

    PCPartPicker Part List: https://pcpartpicker.com/list/QBhKK4

    CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 2600 3.4 GHz 6-Core Processor ($119.99 @ Amazon)
    Motherboard: ASRock Fatal1ty B450 Gaming-ITX/ac Mini ITX AM4 Motherboard ($99.99 @ Newegg)
    Memory: Corsair Vengeance LPX 16 GB (2 x 8 GB) DDR4-2400 Memory ($59.99 @ Amazon)
    Storage: Inland 240 GB 2.5" Solid State Drive ($32.99 @ Amazon)
    Storage: Seagate BarraCuda 1 TB 2.5" 5400RPM Internal Hard Drive ($46.99 @ Newegg)
    Video Card: ASRock Radeon RX 570 4 GB Phantom Gaming D Video Card ($109.99 @ Newegg)
    Case: Fractal Design Node 202 HTPC Case ($78.98 @ Amazon)
    Power Supply: EVGA SuperNOVA GM 450 W 80+ Gold Certified Fully Modular SFX Power Supply ($82.03 @ Amazon)
    Total: $630.95
    ---------------------------------------------------
    #2.

    • RAM: 16 GB -> 8 GB
    • HDD: 1 TB -> None
    • GPU: RX 570 -> GTX 1660 (+ ~30% performance, + 50% VRAM)

    PCPartPicker Part List: https://pcpartpicker.com/list/jYbwyk

    CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 2600 3.4 GHz 6-Core Processor ($119.99 @ Amazon)
    Motherboard: ASRock Fatal1ty B450 Gaming-ITX/ac Mini ITX AM4 Motherboard ($99.99 @ Newegg)
    Memory: Crucial 8 GB (1 x 8 GB) DDR4-2400 Memory ($31.98 @ Newegg)
    Storage: Inland 240 GB 2.5" Solid State Drive ($32.99 @ Amazon)
    Video Card: MSI GeForce GTX 1660 6 GB VENTUS XS OC Video Card ($194.99 @ Newegg)
    Case: Fractal Design Node 202 HTPC Case ($78.98 @ Amazon)
    Power Supply: EVGA SuperNOVA GM 450 W 80+ Gold Certified Fully Modular SFX Power Supply ($82.03 @ Amazon)
    Total: $640.95
    ---------------------------------------------------
    #3.

    • RAM: 16 GB -> 8 GB:

    PCPartPicker Part List: https://pcpartpicker.com/list/K9nddm

    CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 2600 3.4 GHz 6-Core Processor ($119.99 @ Amazon)
    Motherboard: ASRock Fatal1ty B450 Gaming-ITX/ac Mini ITX AM4 Motherboard ($99.99 @ Newegg)
    Memory: Crucial 8 GB (1 x 8 GB) DDR4-2400 Memory ($31.98 @ Newegg)
    Storage: Inland 240 GB 2.5" Solid State Drive ($32.99 @ Amazon)
    Storage: Seagate BarraCuda 1 TB 2.5" 5400RPM Internal Hard Drive ($46.99 @ Newegg)
    Video Card: ASRock Radeon RX 570 4 GB Phantom Gaming D Video Card ($109.99 @ Newegg)
    Case: Fractal Design Node 202 HTPC Case ($78.98 @ Amazon)
    Power Supply: EVGA SuperNOVA GM 450 W 80+ Gold Certified Fully Modular SFX Power Supply ($82.03 @ Amazon)
    Total: $602.94
    ---------------------------------------------------
    #4.

    • RAM: 16 GB -> 8 GB
    • HDD: 1 TB -> None

    PCPartPicker Part List: https://pcpartpicker.com/list/36KcGc

    CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 2600 3.4 GHz 6-Core Processor ($119.99 @ Amazon)
    Motherboard: ASRock Fatal1ty B450 Gaming-ITX/ac Mini ITX AM4 Motherboard ($99.99 @ Newegg)
    Memory: Crucial 8 GB (1 x 8 GB) DDR4-2400 Memory ($31.98 @ Newegg)
    Storage: Inland 240 GB 2.5" Solid State Drive ($32.99 @ Amazon)
    Video Card: ASRock Radeon RX 570 4 GB Phantom Gaming D Video Card ($109.99 @ Newegg)
    Case: Fractal Design Node 202 HTPC Case ($78.98 @ Amazon)
    Power Supply: EVGA SuperNOVA GM 450 W 80+ Gold Certified Fully Modular SFX Power Supply ($82.03 @ Amazon)
    Total: $555.95
    ---------------------------------------------------

    With this, we'll be able to more accurately pinpoint your needs, because as you can tell, you can configure your desktop in any which way you want. However due to the current price of the Ryzen 5 2600, that's already set in stone, the case and power supply and motherboard are unchangeable as well - there's no better options for the mini ITX size at this current time.

    To summarise, here are the components which you can adjust based on your needs/wants at this time:

    • RAM
    • Storage
    • Graphics
  • alaska_vfx_filmeralaska_vfx_filmer Website User Posts: 443 Enthusiast

    CNK, Wow! thats alot of options, thank you so much for all the help here!

  • kevin_nkevin_n Website User Posts: 1,758 Enthusiast
    edited February 8

    Not a problem. The next step is to start thinking about how you want your PC configured. If we use your previous thread as an example, then these configurations are 2.5x faster overall than the laptop which housed the 860m. So in theory, you could get away with a cheaper configuration than those that were suggested. 

    A word of advise, it's better to have 2 drives rather than one. Alternative a smaller nVME drive using the M.2 slot as PCI-e lanes will allow it to read and write simultaneously, this is important for caching and isolating input from output. A SATA SSD cannot do that which means a severe hit in performance working off of 1 drive - even if it had 1 million GB/s write, it wouldn't matter because it's working on a schedule with queues in sequence, there's no parallelisation. To dumb this down further:

    SATA: ~256 commands in a single queue

    nVME: 64k commands in 64k queues - ridiculous parallelisation

    As you're working on your project, by removing any drive I/O bottlenecks you will speed up your general workflow. This is only important if you care about time. If it's not frustrating to wait a lot on different functions then it's of no importance to you and your money is best spent on getting as fast a CPU and GPU you can, but ideally you want a nice, balanced system. 

    Some food for thought. And don't think you're in a hurry, the Ryzen 2600 may not always be sold for $120 like it is now, but if you genuinely can't afford it then that's okay too. :)

  • alaska_vfx_filmeralaska_vfx_filmer Website User Posts: 443 Enthusiast

    Would it be best to go with an  nVME drive then? like this one , I already have a 5tb hdd external drive for backup and a spare 500g internal drive.

  • kevin_nkevin_n Website User Posts: 1,758 Enthusiast
    edited February 9

    Yes, it definitely would but with that, leaving the original CPU, GPU, RAM, you're looking at around $650. However, you could shave off an additional $20 by getting this, which is the cheapest that I could find: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07YFF3JCN?tag=pcpapi-20&linkCode=ogi&th=1&psc=1

    So you'd be looking at this configuration: 

    PCPartPicker Part List: https://pcpartpicker.com/list/RMwC4n

    CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 2600 3.4 GHz 6-Core Processor ($119.99 @ Amazon)
    Motherboard: ASRock Fatal1ty B450 Gaming-ITX/ac Mini ITX AM4 Motherboard ($123.98 @ Newegg)
    Memory: Corsair Vengeance LPX 16 GB (2 x 8 GB) DDR4-2400 Memory ($59.99 @ Amazon)
    Storage: Western Digital Blue SN550 500 GB M.2-2280 NVME Solid State Drive ($64.99 @ Newegg)
    Video Card: ASRock Radeon RX 570 4 GB Phantom Gaming D Video Card ($109.99 @ Newegg)
    Case: Fractal Design Node 202 HTPC Case ($78.98 @ Amazon)
    Power Supply: EVGA SuperNOVA GM 450 W 80+ Gold Certified Fully Modular SFX Power Supply ($83.12 @ Amazon)
    Total: $641.04

    Is the price too high?

    Also, note that these lists are dynamic, Amazon may change to Newegg or w/e is the cheapest at the time without any of our consents as this is how this website is designed to function. If you want to order all components from 1 site then you may have to spend a bit more, on the flipside ordering from different sites may really add to overall shipping. I don't know the shipping rates so we're just eyeballing here. :)

     

  • alaska_vfx_filmeralaska_vfx_filmer Website User Posts: 443 Enthusiast

    CNK, I'm liking the overall look of this, I will definitely have to spread the purchases out between amazon, newegg, and walmart, whichever offers best shipping rates, (amazon doesn't like shipping some things to alaska).

    The price as it stands is great, I was thinking of skipping the case and fabricating something portable, but I will probably play it safe and get the case, and carry it in a modified  power tool case (appropriately vented of course ) fitted out with a monitor, as said before, it has to be a mobile setup.

  • kevin_nkevin_n Website User Posts: 1,758 Enthusiast
    edited February 11

    Okay, cool. Are you happy with the case? There are others but can of course be a process when researching which case fits what. This one is fairly priced and remember there is a premium due to their R&D and fact it's ment to directly compete with consoles. Now, for $650 that's a really powerful system, there's no denying that. I suppose the max with shipping is gonna be about $700-$710. Even then, you won't a better performing system around that price range. If we really decide to look and compare most things that are out there then maybe we'd land at $600.

    "I was thinking of skipping the case and fabricating something portable, but I will probably play it safe and get the case, and carry it in a modified  power tool case"

    My 2 cents. Don't do that, a mini ITX case already has poor airflow, it's super cramped so covering up vents which are on all sides is gonna take away from the intended airflow. As such it would overheat the system either by trapping hot air inside or by the accumulation of dust which happens after you break the negative and positive air flow. You can't just put it in a metal box or a shoe box and cut some holes through it and expect the components to not overheat.

    Instead, store it in any case you want, but take it out before you start using it. Could you try DIY a carrying case or a PC case? Yes, but there are cheap bags that'll fit the dimensions of the Node 202.

  • alaska_vfx_filmeralaska_vfx_filmer Website User Posts: 443 Enthusiast

    @CNK, I was planning on actually tracing the vent openings onto the projected box/case, and perhaps even adding a fan. I am fine with the case listed here, because really, it could be carried around in a good sized briefcase. My original thought was something like this

     

  • kevin_nkevin_n Website User Posts: 1,758 Enthusiast

    The case they use in that video is basically a full size ATX case. It doesn't seem useful at all because you're not converting a full size desktop to a case of that size, you're buying components from scratch and so things will work out a lot better. I also see mistakes they made in that video but I digress, I'll not turn this into CNK's safety rant.

  • alaska_vfx_filmeralaska_vfx_filmer Website User Posts: 443 Enthusiast

     As I say, that was my ORIGINAL plan :-) I didn't know about mini cases then. One large problem with that setup is that it would back a pain to convert back to an ordinary desktop. What about the I idea I mentioned of tracing the venting onto another case? 

  • kevin_nkevin_n Website User Posts: 1,758 Enthusiast

    Ive never operated a CNC machine before so i dont know. But in theory, the insides matters more then the outside. Look at e g the Node 202, its got an isolated GPU chamber and its small designs like that, which could have the biggest impact on temperatures. I think you would have better luck building a bigger case than mini ITX (HTPC).

  • alaska_vfx_filmeralaska_vfx_filmer Website User Posts: 443 Enthusiast
    edited February 11

     Sorry, I didn't mean 3d printing a box, If I did it I would build it out of some non-conductive material, possiply thin plywood, or vinyl/plastic. Were you advising me to go to the larger case? Or to stick with the 202?

  • kevin_nkevin_n Website User Posts: 1,758 Enthusiast

    No, i just answered your question with an example i made about the Node 202's well thought out air flow. 

    Please quote the parts which have you confused. I want to see what mistakes im making because English is my 3-4th language.

    In any case, are you set on a super small case like the Node 202 or are you not?

  • alaska_vfx_filmeralaska_vfx_filmer Website User Posts: 443 Enthusiast
    edited February 11

    It's just that you said, "Look at e g the Node 202, its got an isolated GPU chamber" and then  " I think you would have better luck building a bigger case than mini ITX" just wasnt quite sure if you meant the isolated gpu chamber was good or bad, it's all clear now. The node 202 looks good, what I was thinking of was this, I wold buy the node 202, and also buy some variety of hardcase and trace/cut out the ventholes in alighnment with the 202's vents, I could then install a monitor in the lid and  put the 202 in the bottom so I would basically have a fat laptop that could be turned into a standard desktop pc in a couple of minutes, If it got too hot I could simply take it out of the case. 

  • kevin_nkevin_n Website User Posts: 1,758 Enthusiast

     @LiamMcM1 Yeah you got it. And that sounds pretty cool. I dont have any exp making custom cases like i Said earlier so youll know more than me about that. If you need any more help with the choice of components then ill be happy to help. 

  • alaska_vfx_filmeralaska_vfx_filmer Website User Posts: 443 Enthusiast
    edited February 12

     Levi_12, with all due respect, did you read the rest of this thread? We are discussing a budget, best for low dollar build here, well under 1000$, The build you outline is very nice, but the cost is over $10k, so not in the realm of practical politics here. 

    @CNK, Your reply didn't show until after I posted. I like the look of the build, went and scouted around partpicker and came up with pretty much the same build.

  • kevin_nkevin_n Website User Posts: 1,758 Enthusiast

    It looks like a bot. @TheBenNorris might have a look later. :)

  • alaska_vfx_filmeralaska_vfx_filmer Website User Posts: 443 Enthusiast
    edited February 12

    The thought did cross my mind, only there's no suspicious link

  • TheBenNorrisTheBenNorris Staff Administrator, Website User, Imerge Beta Tester Posts: 1,479 Staff

    I've got my eye on it, don't worry. It's a new account but if the user is a bot i'm unsure what they achieve with their post.

  • alaska_vfx_filmeralaska_vfx_filmer Website User Posts: 443 Enthusiast

    Thats what I was thinking, we'll see if he/she/it replies.

  • kevin_nkevin_n Website User Posts: 1,758 Enthusiast
    edited February 12

    "Your reply didn't show until after I posted. I like the look of the build, went and scouted around partpicker and came up with pretty much the same build."

    Yeah PCPartpicker is fantastic for finding out current pricing on components. When i did this as part of my old job, i used spreadsheets and shopping carts of different web stores due to the country restrictions it had.

    I take it as you are happy with what we put together and that youre ready to order?

    I found this while skimming the American stores https://www.microcenter.com/product/505629/amd-ryzen-5-2600x-36ghz-6-core-am4-boxed-processor-with-wraith-spire-cooler?sku=741181&utm_source=20200206_eNews_Computer_Parts_R5643&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=R5643&MccGuid=d281f4b8-5902-4610-8744-8f82579827df - pickup at store

    This is an even better deal than we found before. Its the same CPU die but clocked higher and its less expensive. Might be worth a look. 

    If you have already ordered the previous CPU then thats fine too. Its still ridiculously good value.

  • alaska_vfx_filmeralaska_vfx_filmer Website User Posts: 443 Enthusiast
    edited February 12

     I have not ordered yet, still considering going up a bit to 32g ram, also, before I'm committed  I wanted to double check reviews on the parts. Some folks might have 13k for their pc, but I like to make sure before I spend even $50 for anything :-)

    Edit, I just was checking the motherboard reviews, and I'm having some doubts. 

  • kevin_nkevin_n Website User Posts: 1,758 Enthusiast

     The CPU is a multitasking beast. 32 GB would do the multitasking capabilities justice.

    Application and RAM usage is very interesting. I mean all my apps require more RAM when I got 16 GB installed, I was using 8 GB before. Heck even Windows used more RAM. And a single Photoshop file was using 4 GB when i was more of a multitasker, same project used almost 10 GB after I got 16 GB. These things vary a lot, and there is a point of diminishing returns even for us VFX oriented peeps, but it certainly isnt 32 GB.

    Im surprised ive been the only one contributing to this thread so far. I think its really interesting. :)

  • alaska_vfx_filmeralaska_vfx_filmer Website User Posts: 443 Enthusiast
    edited February 12

     It happened again :-)

    I refer to previous edit

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