Users are Upset

Andersen01498 Posts: 1,185 Enthusiast
edited July 18 in General

Not my video but HF users have a point..... How is Fx Home going to answer this???


  • GrayMotion
    GrayMotion Posts: 1,628 Enthusiast

    I feel for the guy but I think he jumped the gun and uninstalled Express before he did his due diligence and researched the new product first. He didn't have to uninstall anything. Old and new are in different directories and both can exsist on the same system. He can however simply go to his account and download Express again and he's back in business but I'm not sure about the add-ons. That's a question for FXHome.

    IMHO - This is a classic case of chasing the new, new, new with out the knowledge to make a sound decision. Jumping the gun. Just because its a new release doesn't make it better.

  • Triem23
    Triem23 Posts: 20,689 Ambassador
    edited July 18

    Basically, don't think they will.

    There's been enough exponential growth where most users have forgotten this, but, remember HF 1-5 (2017) were all separate programs with different Installers. Add ons started with HF Express 3 and those add ons carried through to HF 2017. When HF changed to the "single program that updated over itself model" with Pro v6/Express v7 the add on store was rejiggered and add ons from 3/4 didn't carry over. Same outcry at the time.

    I can point to other software for further examples - most notably when Final Cut jumped from 7 to X and broke backwards compatibility with all older versions. AE went through similar outcry when Adobe went sub (although Adobe has the cushion of Hollywood VFX Houses who are kinda stuck unless they wanna get locked out of their own archives). Vegas Pro almost went full subscription (Vegas 365), but, after outcry, kept perpetual plans, but, like a perpetual HF Pro plan and the Content/Templates tabs, perpetual Vegas Pro is missing all the features of the subscription version.

    To be VERY blunt, the users saying "well, you should carry over our add ons to the subscription version" are totally ignorant of programming realities and do not know what they are talking about - and that's still me being nice about it.

    FXhome data shows about 90% of users use Free and never paid a dime. Most of then won't care if they straighten out resolution limits so they can do 1080x1920 vertical. Pro users? Nothing has changed. They have the perpetual option, or can choose to save money in the short (2-3 year) term with the subscription option.

    Express with add on users are pissed, but an issue there is something @NormanPCN and I said explicitly in another thread and @KirstieT touched on in another thread - namely that certain add ons use third party tech and FXhome was eating upgrade costs. To be blunt some Express-with-add-on users were literally costing FXhome money. Pro users have basically been subsidizing Express users for years.

    But I don't know how FXhome can "respond" to this. While I have my own concerns about the new business model, it's NOT going to change back to what it was before. FXhome is going to take a hit in 2022.

    Another thing users aren't getting is exactly how much back end work went into the new Hitfilm. Combining two dev branches into one, adding in the new panels, and doing this while training a largely new dev team on millions of lines of existing code (which may or may not be well documented) is a massive undertaking, especially if prior devs aren't available for a brain-pick (certainly one dev I shan't name can't be asked about his code anymore). These are REASONS, not EXCUSES, yet I do see where users feel not much had been done with the current build, but underlying backend recode and the still-expanding dev team (go look at the "Jobs" section on this site and you'll see FXhome is still hiring coders) will hopefully lead to a return to accelerated development schedule of 2018-2021.

    Unfortunately there isn't anything to be done for the users who are pissed right now. As I said, the old business model isn't coming back and FXhome isn't going to return to paying more in update costs for add ons than users spent in the first place. The choice is, bluntly, stick with Hitfilm or move to something else. Lightworks went subscription, so your free choices are ShotCut and Resolve, and Resolve has substantially higher hardware requirements than Hitfilm.

    Resolve is a total non option for all the users complaining about Hitfilm performance/subscriptions who don't have dedicated GPUs... Hell, I'm looking at buying a machine with an Nvidia 3080 Ti (mobile) which DOES NOT MEET Resolve standards for working with higher than 4k media. The 12GB VRAM in that card doesn't meet Rlesolve standards (20GB) for 6k or 8k media. On my current machine (Nvidia 2060) Resolve cannot handle footage from my BMPCC 6K or my Qoocam 8k. Hitfilm can.

    So, I guess those low hardware users can go to ShotCut, because that's basically their only free option... Well, I suppose technically VirtualDub is an NLE and people overlook Blender's NLE functions...

    As a final comparison note, users comparing Hitfilm to Resolve fail to account for Blackmagic being a hardware vendor which happened to buy out an NLE, DAW and Compositor to bolt onto their color correction software to add value to the ecosystem, but Blackmagic loses money on Resolve. If FXhome sold a ton of $50k color correction interfaces, multiple lines of studio and cinema cameras, multiple lines of video switchers, and an entire buffet line of hardware based format converters, storage drives and playback devices, then they'd also be able to sell perpetual everything. Sadly, FXhome isn't a profitable hardware company that can afford to lose money on an NLE.

    Honestly, my truly biggest WTF with FXhome is killing Ignite without a replacement product ready to go. Oli has said a couple of times FXHOME is working on a replacement for Ignite, but...

  • Andersen01498
    Andersen01498 Posts: 1,185 Enthusiast

    I have to say though at least make users pay for the addons. Thats on them for marketing wise....duh people wont pay for the addons. They probably just put $0 and moved on. Thats on FX home stupidity for marketing. Also....resolution in my opinion shouldn't be capped at 1080p. Davinci Resolve free version has it capped at 4k 60 fps for export. So I don't know why they capped the resolution. As a user of pro, I have a team that edits videos. Everyone else uses Express. I make zero off my videos. So its just kind of frustrating tbh

  • leesang
    leesang Posts: 45 Just Starting Out*
    edited July 18

    1. lightworks 회원가입하며 720P 출력제한이 있지만 무료로 

      사용 가능합니다.

    2. 베가스 프로 구독은 히트필름 구독보다 더 많은 옵션을 제공합니다.

      구독에서 가격말고 우위에 있는 것 없습니다.

    3. 사용자가 프로그램 평가함에 있어 프로그램 외적인 것까지 포함

      평가해야 한다고 생각합니까?

      사용자가 왜 회사 내부 사항까지 알고 있어야 합니까....

    4. 다빈치 리졸브 무료 버전 H.265 포맷 파일 외에 동영상 재생에 하드웨어 

      가속을 지원하지 않으므로 히트필름보다 더 고사양 하드웨어를 요구하는

      것 처럼 느낄 수 있지만 영상 파일을 최적화하여 사용할 수 있는 많은 옵

      션을 제공 합니다.

       다빈치 리졸브 유료 버전과 히트필름 프로를 함께 사용하는 사람으로서 

      다빈치 리졸브에서 버벅이는 작업을 히트필름에서 쉽게 할 수 있는 경우

      은 찾아보기 힘듭니다.

      불행히도 히트필름이 다빈치 리졸브 비교 우위에서 내세울 수 있는 것은

      하드웨어 최소 요구사항 뿐입니다. 

    5. 이 모든 것을 뒤로 하고 사용자 불만은 다른데 있지 않습니다.

      히트필름 작년과 올해 눈에 보이는 업데이트가 없었다는 것 입니다.

       많은 사용자가 요구하던 마크를 업데이트했다고 생각해 보세요.

      애프터 이펙트의 로토 브러쉬, 다빈치 리졸브의 매직 마스크를 

      히트필름에 업데이트 했다고 생각해 보세요.

      베가스 얼마전 업데이트에서 반응형 자막바를 업데이트 했습니다.

      그래도 칭찬보다 비판이 많았을까요....

      사용자가 무엇을 업데이트하며 좋아 하겠다를 생각하십시오.


  • triforcefx
    triforcefx United StatesPosts: 1,566 Moderator

    No product can be supported forever. Express was ALWAYS going to come to an end, it was just a matter of when. In our timeline, that end just so happened to be this year.

    People seem to forget that just because new versions are coming out, it doesn’t mean your old version is any less powerful than it used to be. It met all your needs before, so it should meet all your needs now. You can continue to use your old version for as long as you have a computer that supports it. If you want to try something new, new stuff is always here for you when you’re ready.

    A powerful, free editing and VFX program had never been tried before HitFilm. They’ve had to learn along the way how to sustain it and keep it profitable… and they’re still learning. Before HitFilm, if you wanted anything even close to the power of Express, you had to pay for EVERY NEW VERSION or buy into a subscription. While things have changed, that legacy lives on in Free- and hopefully they’ll learn how to continue to drive profitability to make future versions and products the best they can be.

  • KirstieT
    KirstieT Posts: 1,284 Staff

    @Andersen01498 Please can you amend this post title to moderate your language? I don't personally find offence with the word but in some places and to some people it can constitute swearing.

    Regarding the user, I think that he said it best in his own pinned comment: "UPDATE: I found a way to download and reinstall HitFilm Express, but I had to really drill down into FXHome's website for it, with the help of a Redditor."

    We do include download and installation instructions on the download page, and we also released this video recently for anyone who was struggling:

  • iamkhanproductions
    iamkhanproductions Posts: 526 Enthusiast

    Yeah, there's no need to state the obvious.. Like adding more fuel to the fire dude..

  • Reyfox1
    Reyfox1 Posts: 10 Just Starting Out*

    @Triem23 , part of your above message that reads, "Vegas Pro almost went full subscription (Vegas 365), but, after outcry, kept perpetual plans, but, like a perpetual HF Pro plan and the Content/Templates tabs, perpetual Vegas Pro is missing all the features of the subscription version."

    This is misleading. Vegas was never going full subscription. That was stated at the very beginning when they offered 365 as an option. Outcry? I didn't see it. I saw questions that were quickly answered, end of story, telling the users that there will still be a perpetual license. There was no "outcry" unless people just didn't bother to read.

    As for the missing features in the subscription model vs perpetual. What is missing is that with perpetual, if you don't want to upgrade, you don't have to and you can still edit your projects. With subscription, you stop paying for whatever reason, and you are out of luck, unless you decide to pay up again. You never own the software, it's renting the software.

    Concerning the features that are missing. Vegas Pro editor is still the same. The difference is, like you said, in the missing features. If you don't need "text to speech", "mobile to timeline", and "royalty stock", then why go subscription. That is the ONLY difference. Again, the editor is the same in no matter what version (Edit, Pro, Post, 365). None of the "missing all the features of subscription version" matter to me. So I am missing nothing except continually paying to use the product.

    I use Vegas Edit 19 because I have enough plugins and addons that work in every version of Vegas that I have from Vegas 14 to Vegas 19. And because they are 3rd party OFX plugins, they work in Davinci Resolve 18 Studio (pay once and never pay for an upgrade again... or so they say) and in my version of Hitfilm Pro 2021.3.

    Where I do have a beef with FXHome is that the upgrade perpetual price from 2021.3 to what is now available, is way out there for "me". 280Euros is steep compared to what is out there. Vegas Post costs less as an upgrade for me and gives me the advantage of still doing timeline editing with Vegas while having most of the functionality of HFP and Image, Vegas Stream and Soundforge Studio. Oh, and I have an extensive Smartsound music library that offers great integration with Vegas and the music is highly customizable.

    I am a lurker of sorts here in the forum and do not post much, but read a lot. Does software change? Yes it does. Do the developers and the rest of the company need to have a constant stream of income to continue to develop? Of course! But as I pointed out above, in the current upgrade perpetual form of HFP, it's priced itself out of my computer. And honestly, after a year, what new "must have because it's great" feature is in this release over HFP2021.3. Where is Ignite 6.

  • spyresca
    spyresca Posts: 261 Enthusiast

    Your last paragraph sums up my situation well. I had saved up the the full price in previous years for a full HF pro upgrade, looking for some nice "must have" features to justify the high upgrade price (for "perpetual") .

    As much as I'd like to upgrade, the value proposition just isn't there for me, especially when I can use my current (older) version of ignite to provide many HF features in other NLE's that are better (for me) in terms of editing.