Part of a video is only showing black, audio is loading fine

thekats
thekats Posts: 5 Just Starting Out*

Hello good people,

I've been editing a 14 hour live stream into smaller parts with only a few hiccups. I used handbrake to cut the original video into 2 chunks so I could load the entire stream into HF Express.

Unfortunately, after some back and forth where HF stopped loading the first chunk at all (even though I had been working with the same file just fine the previous day), I am now stuck on the second chunk. I've now tried transcoding (?) it twice; once with peak framerate and once with constant framerate. Either way, HF will only show frames up to a random point in the video and then go to black. In the video I have attached here, it also flickers, which I hadn't noticed before.

The audio plays on fine. Playing back the videos in regular media players is also issue-free.


Both HF and my laptop have run updates recently. I also store all my videos on an external drive to save space on the laptop.

My specs (my apologies if I mix up anything here, I don't know my stuff at all):

  • Intel(R) Core(TM) i7-5500U CPU @ 2.40GHz  2.40 GHz
  • Intel(R) HD Graphics 5500 | NVIDIA GeForce 940M
  • Windows 10, Version 20H2
  • 8.00 GB RAM
  • acer Aspire E17


  • Downloaded then run through handbrake
  • constant framerate
  • 30 FPS | 1920 x 1080 pixels
  • avc1 / Advanced Video Coding / avcC

I really hope you can find where I went wrong because I'm stumped.

Tagged:

Comments

  • Stargazer54
    Stargazer54 Posts: 3,431 Ambassador

    @thekats You are just above minimum spec on the GPU side. Make sure your drivers are updated from the manufacturer and not Microsoft updates, which can actually downgrade drivers.

    That said, the devs have asked that issues with the new update be sent to the support staff directly. Please open a support ticket here:


  • thekats
    thekats Posts: 5 Just Starting Out*
    @Stargazer54 ah, thank you very much! I will make sure to check for updates manually and also report the issue directly.
  • doom7
    doom7 Posts: 8 Just Starting Out
    same issue as mine, btw
  • thekats
    thekats Posts: 5 Just Starting Out*

    @doom7 I've been in contact with support and apparently my GPU doesn't meet requirements (anymore?). I'll try going back to an older version as I had zero issue with the software before and see how that goes.

    I cannot afford just buying a newer device so I can use this one software again - not if everything else runs fine... I could tag you in an update once I get around to it, if you think your issue could be the same?

  • doom7
    doom7 Posts: 8 Just Starting Out
    why would a GPU work with an older version, but not a new one? Anyway, my GPU is slightly better
  • Stargazer54
    Stargazer54 Posts: 3,431 Ambassador

    @doom7 As time goes by, improvements are made to the software that utilize features in newer hardware. After a few updates, lower end gear gets left behind. It's been like this for the last 40 years.

    My rule of thumb for editing suites was to plan on upgrading everything in 5 years and that was in the 90's. Today I would lower that to 3 or 4 years. You buy the meanest, screamingist gear you can afford and pray it will still be viable long enough to afford to upgrade again.

  • Triem23
    Triem23 Posts: 20,070 Ambassador

    @doom7 @thekats to give a concrete example of what @Stargazer54 brings up about changing specs.

    Hitfilm v1 listed the Intel HD 3000 as minimum specs. V4 moved to the HD 4000, v12 the HD 5000.

    Hitfilm is based on an OpenGL/OpenCL core and Hitfilm v16 was a massive update that changed from OpenGL 2.1 to 4.2 while OpenCL moved from 1.0 to 1.2. This opens up the available tech Hitfilm can use moving forward, but it did suddenly make older GPUs (certainly anything end-of-life that never got an OpenGL 4.2 or OpenCL 1.2 patch) unable to run Hitfilm.

    Spec creep is unavoidable. There does come a point where a software package needs to drop backwards compatibility or be unable to improve (There are reasons you're not going to find Win 95-Xp compatible software released in 2021). It sucks for an individual user when forced to replace gear, but you'll find this in all types of high performance software from games to simulation to VFX.

    Still, in the case of something like a 5xxx Intel CPU, the 12th gen CPUs come out soon. 5th gen CPU are 7 generations old. Something like an Nvidia 940 is both the weakest card of its generation, but is four generations old. Eventually it'll happen to today's hardware.

    My six year old laptop was, at the time, basically the highest end thing you could get, but it's getting pretty slow by 2021 standards.

  • thekats
    thekats Posts: 5 Just Starting Out*

    Folx, I get it, I absolutely do. I understand that older tech has to eventually get left behind in order to keep improving things like software. I know my laptop is neither the youngest nor the toughest, I regularly have it pushing CPU and GPU capacity by streaming and gaming on it.

    I was (and still am) merely a bit miffed that the only solution offered to me by official support was to essentially get better hardware, which I simply cannot afford. I've bought some add-ons for HF because I really like working with it and want to support the team behind it. I'm not going to stop using it now just because I can't run the latest version, but I'm also not spending money I don't have because the latest version of a single software doesn't run on my machine any more.

    That's what going back to earlier versions is for and so far that seems to be working perfectly. V2021.1 is loading in my long video no problem and I've not seen any flickering as of yet. Knowing what the issue is was really all I needed. I can keep editing, so I am happy again! :)

    Thanks for the help and the explanations! Have a good one!

  • Stargazer54
    Stargazer54 Posts: 3,431 Ambassador

    @thekats Glad you are back in business with the previous release. I still urge you to contact FXHome support so that they can run to ground what is going on with these fringe cases with 2012.2.

  • NormanPCN
    NormanPCN Posts: 4,081 Enthusiast

    Interesting that support said the GPU is not within min spec. The spec listed this thread by @thekats was Intel HD 5500 and Nvidia 940M. Both at or above the listed min as I read it. I did not see any mention about which GPU was active for Hitfilm.

  • fr33d0m70
    fr33d0m70 Posts: 5 Just Starting Out*

    Same problem, some part of video are black.

    I've upgraded video driver of my nVidia GeForce GTX 1650 SUPER (472.39) but same problem.

    I've removed the 2021.2 and instal the 2021.1 but don't load my new project file. 😔

  • thekats
    thekats Posts: 5 Just Starting Out*

    I mean I was in contact with them and their answer was simply my GPU, so I'm guessing they don't see a real need to look into it further as it's my end. I mean, I would be thrilled if they had a way to keep their updated versions downward compatible or could release them one high spec one low spec, but that's understandably quite a bit of fuss over luxurious hobbies. Anyone financially dependent on using this software will likely have a budget to keep their tech up to date.

    Yes, I was surprised too after @Stargazer54 pointed out I was just above minimum. But support asked me to run a diagnostic tool to spit out a file, so something in there might have revealed dark secrets my laptop tried to hide from me :D

    Oh, pardon, I forgot to mention that. Yes, previous versions can't open files created or worked on in a newer release... In my case this only meant repeating some cuts, but if you have something with a lot more work put into it, maybe you can export up to where you start having issues in the latest release and then work on the rest in the previous version and just glue them together? If you re-download the current release it should be able to open the file like usual, I think.

  • Triem23
    Triem23 Posts: 20,070 Ambassador
    edited November 3

    @NormanPCN

    I think the min specs listed on the page aren't accurate. 😐

    Now I start speculating wildly.

    First, something I know. Hitfilm is largely OpenGL based. Prior versions of Hitfilm used OpenGL 2.1, with HF 16 it moved to OpenGL 4.2

    I suspect Hitfilm treats all planar Timeline objects - whether a plane layer, text layer, or photo/video layer as a texture mapped poly.

    Now on to speculation.

    While older GPUs can upgrade to newer vetsions of OpenGL, not every GPU actually supports all the OpenGL functions.

    This page looks at the Intel 5500 and OpenGL 4.3. Sorry, wasn't able to find a similar table for 4.2, this site has no data for the Nvidia 940m, and I'm not doing more searching.

    Key thing is the nice color coded chart shows which OpenGL 4.3 functions the Intel 5500 doesn't support.

    One example is "shader image load store." Here's a partial definition of the function pulled from Khronos.

    This extension provides GLSL built-in functions allowing shaders to load
        from, store to, and perform atomic read-modify-write operations to a
        single level of a texture object from any shader stage.  These built-in
        functions are named imageLoad(), imageStore(), and imageAtomic*(),
        respectively, and accept integer texel coordinates to identify the texel
        accessed. 
    

    Again, as you know, I am no coder, but, to my layman eyes this seems to deal with the GPUs ability to load, hold and modify texture data on a poly.

    My inexpert conclusion is that the Intel 5500 NOT supporting this extension might cause issues with video that's really a texture shaded poly. If I'm correct video objects in Hitfilm are really textures polys, and I'm correct that this unsupported extension does what I think it does, then this could absolutely make the Intel 5500 incompatible with HF 17+

    So it may be a situation where each GPU needs to be cross referenced with all supported OpenGL extensions for compatibility?

    Or, I'm totally wrong. As I said, speculating wildly based on public information and incomplete understanding of the tech.

  • fr33d0m70
    fr33d0m70 Posts: 5 Just Starting Out*

    My video card (nVidia GeForce GTX 1650 SUPER with latest driver) support OpenGl 4.6 but the problem is there.

  • Stargazer54
    Stargazer54 Posts: 3,431 Ambassador

    @thekats Per not opening newer versions of project files in earlier versions of HF.

    It is always a good rule of thumb to save incremental copies of your work as you proceed through a project. E.G. - file001, file002, file003, etc. A benefit of this is if you you mess up file003, you can always fall back to file002 and pick up before you left off. Or if you upgrade and want to go back to a previous version of the software you have versions that will work with it. Also, before upgrading any software you should always make a back-up of your project file before proceeding with an update.

  • NormanPCN
    NormanPCN Posts: 4,081 Enthusiast
    edited November 3

    @Triem23 I accept what you looked at and it that is good work. Yes extensions can be an issue. That is why a dev needs to decide do I or do I not.

    One thing curious about that specific extension and Intel HD 5500. One driver version does support it but not a later version. Maybe there was a bug and they just took it away.

    "I suspect Hitfilm treats all planar Timeline objects - whether a plane layer, text layer, or photo/video layer as a texture mapped poly."

    I also believe this to be true. I believe they've always done that even in the old GL 2 era. IMO. Now GLSL has not really changed so that code is as is. By that I mean the code the computes your effect, like a glow, is the same. That said, how one organizes the data and hopefully tries to setup a pipeline to minimize stalls to get best performance, well then GL 3.0 and later have new buffer object types to help/allow such things. Big time in 3.0. The listed extension appears to be written against GL 3.2. Hopefully the use of new GL stuff gives better performance otherwise, why change. Better something at least. FxHome has to prove performance/capability first. IMO.

    With things like this (GL extension), if true, FxHome can never list a spec that an end user can understand. The spec can only be generic as is. The question is, why, if you are using an extension that a driver does not support are you letting the app run. Possibly incorrectly. An error dialog at startup. A missing item being used would mean the app would not run at all. Not that it would run but incorrectly with intermittent blank/black frames (or whatever the report is). For this I question, the existence of a missing extension/api for running but intermittently incorrectly. This seems to be the report this thread. Of course, if not check is done and and extension is used it may only be used some specific effect/function. If things go bad after a specific point then it could be that feature was used at that point on the timeline.

  • Triem23
    Triem23 Posts: 20,070 Ambassador

    @NormanPCN of course I can't answer the questions posed in your final paragraph. I don't even know if I'm on the right track with my speculations, but... It's my best theory after 90 minutes of Googling and reading.

    I did notice column variation by driver. Odd. Then again, that site referenced hasn't updated since 2015, but it's the only site I found (quickly) with that type of breakdown.

    My only other observation is the OpenGL spec deprecated some 2.x features in 3.x and removed those deprecated features in 4.x. I do know huge portions of Hitfilm were rewritten, but don't know how deprecated features affected things, if at all.

    I assume with the sheer number of "viable" hardware configurations it's effectively impossible for any company to test against every eventuality.

  • littlehausbigcity
    littlehausbigcity Posts: 54 Just Starting Out*

    Hate to jump in here, but Triem23 mentioned that I ran into when I went directly to support with the reports as suggested and was told my graphics card specifically is below spec. Well, at that time, it WAS listed as a minimum spec (Nvidia Geforce 600 series cards, mine being the 610GT with 1G of memory), which was initially released in 2012 (again, listed), but I bought mine in 2015 when Fry's was still a going concern to replace an older ATI Radeon 4850HD graphics card that had gone south in my older Dell Studio XPS machine.

    To further rub salt into the womb, I discovered that by going with a third party vendor for the Nvidia card (PNY), I was UNDERSPEC because PNY chose to go with Ferni 2.0, not Kepler for the GPU architecture. Further research revealed that some 700, and 800 series cards will use Kepler (and by extension, some will still utilize Ferni). I then suspected that even the 900 series cards may be affected as well, and Triem23 brings this up. So my suspicion that the specs should be updated to the bare minimum for 2021.2 may help many of us that are on the margins.

    That said, I can find new low end cards for around $100-$150 US dollars, but suspect that I'll still be bouncing about at the ragged edge of compatibility with even Hitfilm, even if all I did was find an Nvidia Geforce 730, with Kepler for around $100 on a 4th gen Core i5 computer and only be slightly improved, and it was the bare minimum specs listed that I went with HF 2021.1 in the first place, just to keep going with editing until I could upgrade. I hope to next year by replacing the entire PC with a fresh one. But in the meantime, I can edit alright as is despite everything and just found out today my internet went WAY up in speed, 55mbps down, 10mbps up, or actually 47mbps down when I ran the speed test, 10, up so that helps.

  • Triem23
    Triem23 Posts: 20,070 Ambassador

    @littlehausbigcity well it certainly doesn't help that manufacturer "Ps" 610 isn't the same as manufacturer "N's" 610.

    Whatever happened to truth in advertising?

  • littlehausbigcity
    littlehausbigcity Posts: 54 Just Starting Out*

    Triam, very true. Fortunately the 730 I found does use Kepler and is from MSI. That said, I'll soldier on with what I have, for now, unless the poor 610 goes south... I also found a 10XX card I think it was for $150 I think it was so there is that. Both could be had from Egghead as of Oct and both in stock if I recall.

    Oh well. Too bad any halfway decent card, like a 1020 or so is now costing close to $600 at the moment.

  • Triem23
    Triem23 Posts: 20,070 Ambassador

    @littlehausbigcity crypto miners ruining it for everyone else...

  • littlehausbigcity
    littlehausbigcity Posts: 54 Just Starting Out*

    Triam23, indeed.

  • NormanPCN
    NormanPCN Posts: 4,081 Enthusiast

    @Triem23 "Then again, that site referenced hasn't updated since 2015"

    Hmm, did not look at that. Probably should ignore such things. After all, what is the first thing anyone says...update your drivers.

    Depreciated does not necessarily mean a lot. It means something may not be there but remember, Hitfilm was an OpenGL 2.x app and running under drivers supporting GL 4.x. GL 4 is really quite old as a spec. As an implementation it certainly varies widely how quickly adopted. The depreciated features, if they were used, are still there since Hitfilm ran. Of course the driver can state I do not run older apps. In other words, saying they do not support GL 2.x apps. A bit dangerous that. Of course, just dealing with GPU drivers and their variety and quirks can seem a bit "dangerous" at times. Cost of doing business I guess.