HitFilm City - New update Booooom

NXVisualStudioNXVisualStudio Moderator, Website User, Ambassador, HitFilm Beta Tester Posts: 687 Ambassador
edited February 2016 in General

In light of @SimonKJones recent hint for (update 3) I have decided to carry on with the project that I'd abandoned due to the amount of counter productive modelling techniques to eliminate model spasm (Z -Fighting)/ Clip overlord or what ever one would like to call it ;) 

The Video Co-Pilot city is a nice bit of kit However, it doesn't take full advantages of the texture systems that we now have in 4Pro.

The aim will be to get the City to look as photo real as possible, to react as nicely as you would expect with the new Fresnel and Roughness settings, to have the optimised ability to handle a large quantity under particle dispersion, AO, Motion blur and shadowing with out being a Huge strain for gl overhead,

The thing is, is it something you guys would want? for as long as I know that it's something that would be needed/used by the Community then I'd happily put them on the market,

As apart of one of the tutorials in the near future, I have a few actors in to help with the demonstration, it's a very short mini film that demonstrates some new 3Dimensional energy dispersion effects that are created from procedural emission, the film will be a Dragon Ball Z short so that's a clue to the effects that will be involved and the City will be featured as a part advertisement.

So, What do you reckon? ;)      

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Comments

  • Triem23Triem23 Moderator Moderator, Website User, Ambassador, Imerge Beta Tester, HitFilm Beta Tester Posts: 18,228 Ambassador

    One can always use more citues, and a pack specifically optimized for Hitfilm would eliminate the tedious searching for free models that don't have geometry, or even all the tedious relinking happening when importing VideoCopilot products. 

  • NXVisualStudioNXVisualStudio Moderator, Website User, Ambassador, HitFilm Beta Tester Posts: 687 Ambassador
    edited January 2016

    @Triem23 setting up the models in a project file is a good idea, the last pack was for universal compatibility , I guess this makes it 'HitFilm' only, the files will need saving in 2 ultimate at least, in-order for this to work along the product line, this would mean that there will need to be manual normal reapplication and built in light setup for the 4 Pro users, 

    I'm not sure what the best solution is right now, having it vastly available to users of other software? that would entail the tedious setup you mention,

    The other thing would be the use of market targeting if this is solely for HitFilm, would I have the permissions to use the company name ? it would strengthen the asset margin,

  • StormyKnightStormyKnight Moderator, Website User, Ambassador, Imerge Beta Tester, HitFilm Beta Tester Posts: 2,726 Ambassador

    NXVisualStudio - "The Video Co-Pilot city is a nice bit of kit However, it doesn't take full advantages of the texture systems that we now have in 4Pro."

    I've been thinking about getting the city pack for about a year but just haven't had the $. Hopefully this March (?). What does it lack regarding texturing and HF?

    I'd be interested in an alternative as you laid out above!

  • Triem23Triem23 Moderator Moderator, Website User, Ambassador, Imerge Beta Tester, HitFilm Beta Tester Posts: 18,228 Ambassador

    Tony, creating Hitfilm projects (Composite Shots?) doesn't make it "Hitfilm Only," although it's good marketing for Hitfilm users (or, if you have E3D, set it up for that, too!). Users of other software can still import the models--they just might have to do setup. Like when Hitfilm users have to set up Andrew Kramer models. 

    As far as setup goes, you're going to have to build something with lights and textures both in your modelling software and Hitfilm while testing, so that's two packages you could have project files for. 

    Or, offer the same models as "different" products? Remember, Hitfilm stores model geometry in a project or comp shot file. You could do the Hitfilm version which is all project files and textures (no seperate models), and the straight, unsetup models/textures version. 

    @StormyKnight Tony's shown me a few work-in-progress screen shots. Looking pretty nice! 

  • NXVisualStudioNXVisualStudio Moderator, Website User, Ambassador, HitFilm Beta Tester Posts: 687 Ambassador

    @StormyKnight It comes down to a few things that are from observation, when I look at the differences in comparison to a render in HitFilm to that of Element there are features missing that give the Metropolitan pack it's vibrant benefits in element, the depth from a distant shot to a close shot is noticeable, once you are close to the building in HitFilm it becomes apparent that there is a texture degradation due to the texture resolution and the way in which the texture apply's on the model, the key differences are the texture UVW Map setup  on my behalf, finding the balance to make it look incredibly detailed from a close up shot of a building and not making it look like the tiling is repeated when further back in the distance and that depends on the textures that are applied so it will involve key balance between the normals/ specular and diffuse vs tiling and gizmo scale,

    the other thing that makes it different is the price, the Video Co Pilot price is 124.95 US Dollars and the one I make will be £9.99-14.21 US Dollar

    It's affordable and makes me something along the line as this job will be a professional finish designed for the specific software in mind, 

    By all means get the Video Co-Pilot version and down the line mix it up with the Newly polished HitFilm version ;)    

  • NXVisualStudioNXVisualStudio Moderator, Website User, Ambassador, HitFilm Beta Tester Posts: 687 Ambassador

    @Triem23 that's a pretty good point, I guess we can balance it out as you suggested it is how ever painstaking and will indeed involve going back and forth from software's but it should be worth it in the end,

    Who ever it was who posted this ( was one of the reasons I wanted to do this, it's the way the city look....****!

    @SimonKJones as you're Mr Marketing buff what do you thinks the best approach ?

  • Triem23Triem23 Moderator Moderator, Website User, Ambassador, Imerge Beta Tester, HitFilm Beta Tester Posts: 18,228 Ambassador

    Tony, I ever tell you I did the initial audio design for the DBZ/Funimation Site? That's the US distributor, so we may have just been the US site. 

  • StormyKnightStormyKnight Moderator, Website User, Ambassador, Imerge Beta Tester, HitFilm Beta Tester Posts: 2,726 Ambassador
    edited February 2016

    @NXVisualStudio - The price range is definitely good for me and I trust @Triem23's judgment (and yours)- I am definitely interested! Tax time is right around the corner and that's when I do a bunch of selfish buying and bill paying- maybe I'm actually consoling myself after bill paying. lol  And I do prefer 'as realistic as I can get' FX. I'll add it to the list with Rodypolis' new FX pack, Reaper and 2 VideoCopilot model packs (city and Jetstrike). Count me in!

  • NXVisualStudioNXVisualStudio Moderator, Website User, Ambassador, HitFilm Beta Tester Posts: 687 Ambassador

     @Triem23  No you didn't! you did however tell me about your dinosaur noises ;) If you would like to send over some "Rawrahhhhh" power up noises then please do, because I bloody well wont be :') and I can have you in the credits :P

     @StormyKnight I've seen the work Rodypolis has put in to the kit, a perfectionist at that, I would advise getting that before any other in fact,

    As I say, It will hopefully be photo real in the end, well that's the aim, :)

  • NXVisualStudioNXVisualStudio Moderator, Website User, Ambassador, HitFilm Beta Tester Posts: 687 Ambassador

    @StormyKnight
    Just messaged you some test shot of the City, the first three models are getting there shaders set up for reflections and texture detail. :)  

  • PawPawPawPaw Website User Posts: 54

    I'd love to have a city model for a good price....this all sounds amazing

  • AramMAramM Website User Posts: 154 Enthusiast

    I am definitely interested.

  • WurminatorWurminator Website User Posts: 18
  • NXVisualStudioNXVisualStudio Moderator, Website User, Ambassador, HitFilm Beta Tester Posts: 687 Ambassador

     It's good to hear lads :) here is a test pass on a few models from an early stage

    Unless update 3 has random 90* rotations included I might have to set out template blocks that manually do that for you, other than that if you loose track of what you are doing and look back from the top of the building it gives you vertigo, that or I'm a complete wimp of any hight ;)   

  • Triem23Triem23 Moderator Moderator, Website User, Ambassador, Imerge Beta Tester, HitFilm Beta Tester Posts: 18,228 Ambassador

    That just looks really nice. I think a point or two of Ambient light would blend your buildings into the Environment Map better, but that's being overly picky about a proof of concept test. Those buildings are going to be spectacular! 

  • NXVisualStudioNXVisualStudio Moderator, Website User, Ambassador, HitFilm Beta Tester Posts: 687 Ambassador

    @Triem23 Overly picky is the aim ;) Xander thought the building floating in the background was a PoliceBox, I'm not that bad :') 

    these are dumped into the scene for the reflections test and you have seen the texture test video, I've done an over head test and its looking good, there was six models plus the city road block, then they are placed in a grid emitting at 200 particle spread, 

    other than Mr clip making it's self known the handles are very efficient, 

    @Ady @CedricBonnier Is there any dibs on this API overhead with Direct X 12 for improving performance particularly with Draw calls ?

  • SimonKJonesSimonKJones Moderator Website User, HitFilm Beta Tester Posts: 4,450 Enthusiast

    I'd probably advise at selling a single pack, with compatibility for multiple hosts. A bit like how we sell HitFilm Ignite for ALL hosts, rather than selling multiple versions at wildly different prices like some other plugin developers. It's just a nicer message for potential customers.

    As for using the HitFilm name - you're more than welcome to say something along the lines of "Fully compatible with HitFilm 4 Pro" or "Designed for HitFilm 4 Pro" or variants on that, as long as you don't imply that we endorse the pack or were involved in its creation.

    I would advise doing a HitFilm 4 Pro-specific project setup, because the new grid emitters and enhanced texture/lighting options in 4 provide numerous advantages over, say, HitFilm 2 Pro's rendering. By all means include a HF2-compatible version as well, but in terms of making your product look its absolute best, you're going to want to go with 4.

    Looking forward to checking out the pack! I love me some procedural cityscapes.

  • NXVisualStudioNXVisualStudio Moderator, Website User, Ambassador, HitFilm Beta Tester Posts: 687 Ambassador

    @SimonKJones That's not a bad Idea, I guess sticking to 4 specifically would make it easier for me, the models will import on any version and won't require re-linking but will need to manually drop each individual model into the scene, 

    on the other hand there will be tiled city blocks for randomisation in 4 pro, As @Triem23 has mentioned, the City needs lights, building lights specifically and that's proving tedious but I've come up with a way around this, the down side to this is making a project setup that involves (Day and Night) and ramps up the overall file size by double, I'm not sure if CGTrader charges by file size but one thing's for sure, the product will be sold from the new NeonVisual website once we have finished making it,

    'you're more than welcome to say something along the lines of "Fully compatible with HitFilm 4 Pro" or "Designed for HitFilm 4 Pro"' Opps I think I'd better change the Title on CGTrader, the box cover says Celestial Model Pack - Designed for HitFilm but the title says HitFilm Celestail Model Pack :|

    Anyway I'll continue in your message.

     

  • Triem23Triem23 Moderator Moderator, Website User, Ambassador, Imerge Beta Tester, HitFilm Beta Tester Posts: 18,228 Ambassador

    One thing to think about is getting base materials settings optimized for Hitfilm in MAX. For example, Diffuse and Specular colors around 128, 128, 128 look a lot better in Hitfilm than 255, 255, 255. So even if textures need to be relinked, everything else is correct for HF2/HF3 users. 

    Yeah, sorry, Night Maps add more work. You want to send me some day textures and I'll paint in windows? 

  • NXVisualStudioNXVisualStudio Moderator, Website User, Ambassador, HitFilm Beta Tester Posts: 687 Ambassador

    @Triem23 that's a very thoughtful suggestion, as you will be testing the first batch it seems the logical thing to do, the window set up will consist of 512x512 tiles by default, what I need to do is make a one off image that equals to that of the overall tile scale of each buildings map size, for the night buildings, this means an image for example 3000x2000 with complete randomisation of lights, if the night lights are tiled like the default day light textures then it becomes painfully obvious that it's repetitive, I'll talk to you over facebook on some payment. 

    'One thing to think about is getting base materials settings optimized for Hitfilm in MAX. For example, Diffuse and Specular colors around 128, 128, 128 look a lot better in Hitfilm than 255, 255, 255' By default 'subconsciously' I did that from the very start, learning from the mistakes with a few of the models in the CMP,

    Do you have a graphic design/Wacom? I could Imagen using a mouse or touch pad being damned awful! 

    Right now the important parts are the textures, if it doesn't look photo real from a close perspective then it goes in the bin/ reworked, so the baking will be spot on from the moment anyone loads the project file and they can adjust to their taste, I'll upload the over head test tonight. 

  • SimonKJonesSimonKJones Moderator Website User, HitFilm Beta Tester Posts: 4,450 Enthusiast

    It's not a huge deal - we just don't want anyone to get confused either way.

  • Triem23Triem23 Moderator Moderator, Website User, Ambassador, Imerge Beta Tester, HitFilm Beta Tester Posts: 18,228 Ambassador

    Yeah, Tony, I have my trusty Intuos 4. 

  • NXVisualStudioNXVisualStudio Moderator, Website User, Ambassador, HitFilm Beta Tester Posts: 687 Ambassador

    @Triem23  Woow we have the same family of graphics tablets , I'll get to it by tonight, this scripts really starting to annoy me, it gets good then I'm thinking 'that will take ages to create' sod it, sticks on the metal to follow some classical stuff doesn't do itself **** it.

    @SimonKJones Well I'm thankful you didn't fire a gatling gun filled with lawyers at me haha, I will change it though. :)


  • HarHar Website User Posts: 400 Just Starting Out

    Been away for a bit and just saw this. As someone who's been toying with getting the VCP city for a while now, put me down as absolutely interested too. 

  • karmakarma Website User Posts: 165 Enthusiast

    I'm quite interested.  Count me in.

    Mike

  • NXVisualStudioNXVisualStudio Moderator, Website User, Ambassador, HitFilm Beta Tester Posts: 687 Ambassador
    edited February 2016

    Cheers everyone it's really good to get feedback especially at these stages!

    The following is a quick update PDF for you to download and look at some of the new features being put into its development :)

    https://www.dropbox.com/s/inaqmvvbmfk8y9o/Update 2.pdf?dl=0
    @karma  @Har  @Triem23 @Wurminator @AramM @PawPaw @StormyKnight @SimonKJones

  • NXVisualStudioNXVisualStudio Moderator, Website User, Ambassador, HitFilm Beta Tester Posts: 687 Ambassador
  • BriReddBriRedd Website User Posts: 98 Just Starting Out

    Will you take payment in advance?! 

  • NXVisualStudioNXVisualStudio Moderator, Website User, Ambassador, HitFilm Beta Tester Posts: 687 Ambassador

    Reflection/ water on roof test


    Hi @BriRedd I haven't got any payment system set up for the pack yet :) once it's all packed up I'll give off the update and promo video with the link to the store :)

  • Triem23Triem23 Moderator Moderator, Website User, Ambassador, Imerge Beta Tester, HitFilm Beta Tester Posts: 18,228 Ambassador

    Tony, you've been a busy boy! PDF looks good (good breakdown of your aim, too), and that water test looks fantastic.

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