Still having playback issues..

I just got back from a 4-month contract out of town, and noticed that there's an update for HF2. I was hoping this update would solve my playback issues, but no... the chugging is still there in my Canon MOV files. HF2 cannot play them back in real time, whereas HF1 can deal with them no problem.
Looks like I'll still be working on HF1 for a while...  :( 
At least, I can do other tasks on HF2 and export stuff to HF1 (I haven't tried opening HF2 workspaces on HF1... maybe it'll work). I just wish I didn't have to shuffle things around this much.
Ah, well... maybe a future update. Crossing fingers...

Comments

  • SimonKJones
    SimonKJones Posts: 4,448 Enthusiast
    edited March 2013
    Are you working in 8-bit of 16-bit mode? This is set in the advanced tab of the Project screen. 
  • Toonman
    Toonman Posts: 81
    I tested both. 8-bit plays back slightly faster, but it's also choppy (not real-time). HF1 has no problem playing back in real-time in either 8 or 16-bit modes on my system.
    Let me know if there's more info I can provide. Thanks Simon!
  • Ady
    Ady Posts: 1,531 Enthusiast
    I just got back from a 4-month contract out of town, and noticed that there's an update for HF2. I was hoping this update would solve my playback issues, but no... the chugging is still there in my Canon MOV files. HF2 cannot play them back in real time, whereas HF1 can deal with them no problem.
    Looks like I'll still be working on HF1 for a while...  :( 
    At least, I can do other tasks on HF2 and export stuff to HF1 (I haven't tried opening HF2 workspaces on HF1... maybe it'll work). I just wish I didn't have to shuffle things around this much.
    Ah, well... maybe a future update. Crossing fingers...


    Hi,
    Are the .MOV files using the h.264 Codec? If so, could you back them up (copy them to a separate location for example), then rename their file extensions to .MP4, does performance improve?
    Thanks,
    Ady

  • Toonman
    Toonman Posts: 81
    Well, that's interesting. The Mp4 file did play better, but only under 8-bit, and it's still choppy and I see some strobing when the camera pans.
    The other problem is that I won't be working with the MOV files directly. I always transcode my footage to something like ProRes 4:2:2 to work with it, and so far, all the transcodes files I've generated suffer from the same issue. HF1 plays them back without any issues, this is what puzzles me...
  • Toonman
    Toonman Posts: 81
    Looks like I'm stuck with this one :-(. I remember reading others had similar issues when HF2 came out. Did everyone worked them out? Any pointers? Thanks!
  • Ady
    Ady Posts: 1,531 Enthusiast
    Looks like I'm stuck with this one :-(. I remember reading others had similar issues when HF2 came out. Did everyone worked them out? Any pointers? Thanks!


    Hi,
    Sorry, didn't see your reply.
    Would you be able to upload some sample footage of what you're having trouble with so we could take a look at it here in the Office? You could upload it to here, where upon I'll take a look at it right away.
    Also could you detail your system specifications below:
    Operating System:
    CPU:
    Memory:
    Graphics Card:
    Many Thanks,
    Ady

  • Toonman
    Toonman Posts: 81
    Sounds good. I'll edit a small clip so you can take a look and let you know in this thread when I'm done with the upload. Cheers Ady!
  • Toonman
    Toonman Posts: 81

    I have uploaded a sample clip. It's named MVI_0697.MOV (37.0 MB in size). The clip plays real-time in Hit Film 1, VLC media player, and Quicktime player. It will not play real-time in Hit Film 2 (HF2 skips frames to keep the playback real-time).
    My computer specs are:
    CPU: Dual Intel Xeon E5405 2.00 GHz processors (4 cores each)
    Memory: 12.0 GB
    OS: Windows 7 64-bit, SP1.
    Graphics Card: Nvidia GeForce GTX 550 Ti, 4095 MB RAM (2047 shared), drivers version 314.22 (latest).
    I hope this helps.  Let me know if you need more information, or if you spot something obvious in my video or configuration that causes problems in HF2.
    Thanks Ady!

  • Ady
    Ady Posts: 1,531 Enthusiast
    I have uploaded a sample clip. It's named MVI_0697.MOV (37.0 MB in size). The clip plays real-time in Hit Film 1, VLC media player, and Quicktime player. It will not play real-time in Hit Film 2 (HF2 skips frames to keep the playback real-time).
    My computer specs are:
    CPU: Dual Intel Xeon E5405 2.00 GHz processors (4 cores each)
    Memory: 12.0 GB
    OS: Windows 7 64-bit, SP1.
    Graphics Card: Nvidia GeForce GTX 550 Ti, 4095 MB RAM (2047 shared), drivers version 314.22 (latest).
    I hope this helps.  Let me know if you need more information, or if you spot something obvious in my video or configuration that causes problems in HF2.
    Thanks Ady!


    Hi,
    Thanks for the upload, I see a file named MVI_597.MOV which I assume is the correct one due to the upload date & I'm downloading now.
    Once I have the file I'll run through some checks on the test machines here & get back to you.
    Thank you for your patience & understanding whilst we try to resolve this issue for you.
    Kind Regards
    Ady 

  • Toonman
    Toonman Posts: 81
    Thank you very much Ady. Looking forward to your findings... cheers!
  • Ady
    Ady Posts: 1,531 Enthusiast
    Thank you very much Ady. Looking forward to your findings... cheers!


    Hi,
    I've run a few tests with the file on the test machines it appears the video file has an unlabeled Alpha Channel, did you know this? 
    It plays back at double the FPS when the file extension is renamed to .MP4.
    Performance is better in HitFilm 1, but the way in which HitFilm 1 handled .MOV's mean't that certain .MOV files didn't work at all. This change has made HitFilm 2 more robust in it's handling of .MOV files but has affected the performance of certain codecs.
    It's worth noting that other video editors also struggle with the file getting in & around the same playback FPS sometimes lower as HitFilm.
    My advice would be to convert the file to more friendly editing format. It might be worth reading this forum post by Axel here, this talks about using the right codec when editing.
    Thanks,
    Ady

  • Toonman
    Toonman Posts: 81
    edited April 2013
    Hello Ady. How did you find this alpha channel? I can't seem to find it with some of the tools I have.
    It's weird too... this is a file straight off the DSLR. I didn't know the camera would be embedding an alpha channel in the movie... I'll try to find more info around this.
    Lastly, yes, I do always transcode my files, so I'm never really editing the movies that come from the DSLR. I'm mostly using ProRes for editing. I just tried it, and using a ProRes transcoded file, and reducing the rendering bit depth for the project to 8-bit, things improve. But playback is still not real-time. I can upload the transcoded video file if you wish.
    Thanks for your help. I certainly hope things could be improved further in this regard, since real-time playback is, well... important to get the rhythm of the project right.
    Thank you again. Let me know if you wish to pursue this issue further. Cheers!
  • Ady
    Ady Posts: 1,531 Enthusiast
    Hello Ady. How did you find this alpha channel? I can't seem to find it with some of the tools I have.
    It's weird too... this is a file straight off the DSLR. I didn't know the camera would be embedding an alpha channel in the movie... I'll try to find more info around this.
    Lastly, yes, I do always transcode my files, so I'm never really editing the movies that come from the DSLR. I'm mostly using ProRes for editing. I just tried it, and using a ProRes transcoded file, and reducing the rendering bit depth for the project to 8-bit, things improve. But playback is still not real-time. I can upload the transcoded video file if you wish.
    Thanks for your help. I certainly hope things could be improved further in this regard, since real-time playback is, well... important to get the rhythm of the project right.
    Thank you again. Let me know if you wish to pursue this issue further. Cheers!


    Hi,
    Sorry for the delay in getting back to you.
    After Effects shows that the file has an unlabeled Alpha Channel, although it could be entirely spurious & not even an Alpha Channel, it's just AE thinks it is. It is possible there is a setting on the Camera to not save this information though, might be worth checking.
    Yes, would you mind uploading the Transcoded file so I can run through some test procedures here.
    I'm happy to continue helping you with this if you are.
    Thanks,
    Ady 

  • Toonman
    Toonman Posts: 81
    Looks like my ProRes files play back better if I reduce my color depth from 16 to 8 bits.
    I've tried transcoding the same file to ProRes LT (the lightest file I could manage), and it's a bit over your 50 MB limit. Is there any other way I can get it to you, or should I try uploading it anyway?
    Thanks Ady. Glad to help you with this. Cheers!
  • Ady
    Ady Posts: 1,531 Enthusiast
    Looks like my ProRes files play back better if I reduce my color depth from 16 to 8 bits.
    I've tried transcoding the same file to ProRes LT (the lightest file I could manage), and it's a bit over your 50 MB limit. Is there any other way I can get it to you, or should I try uploading it anyway?
    Thanks Ady. Glad to help you with this. Cheers!


    Hi,
    By better is it real time or is it just 'better'?
    I'll PM with another upload solution you can use, it will be sent to my work email here at the Office that way.
    No worries, we are here to help.
    Thanks,
    Ady

  • Toonman
    Toonman Posts: 81
    It "looks" like real-time or close to (HF lacks an FPS counter to know exactly what the playback speed is, so it's hard to tell). However, I would like to be able to keep my color bit-depth at 16 bit float to avoid potential degradation problems from heavy processing. Can I go to 8-bit for playback, and then switch to 16-bit just before rendering (after checking everything looks ok) without any detrimental consequences to my project? Is this supported?
    Thanks Ady! I'll catch up with you on PM.