Intel CEO on the Evolution of PCs. Are you interested in a Complet?

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  • guitar74
    guitar74 Posts: 506

    I can't recall a time while watching a movie when I've ever thought "this is a bit flat", though. While traditional film is projected onto a flat surface, it's still representing a 3D location that was filmed. It's not like a video camera somehow magically sucks out all perspective from a shot.
    3D movies where things jump out of the screen I actually understand a lot more. 3D makes a TON of sense for some genres, like shlocky horror. Great fun. But used subtly, 3D might as well not be there at all.
    If 3D was non-intrusive then it wouldn't matter either way - I have nothing explicitly against 3D as a concept because, as I say, it doesn't really make a difference for me whether it's there or not. But the triple-whammy of annoying glasses, darkened projection and ridiculously inflated ticket prices mean that 3D is a no-go area for me currently.
    I guess what I mean is, that a flat screen is just how movies were brought to us. Thats what I mean by flat, but the 3d to me it makes me feel like I kind of was there in a way... Hard to explain.
    Your quote " It's not like a video camera somehow magically sucks out all perspective from a shot." I always wondered about that, why does that happen?
  • MichaelJames
    MichaelJames Posts: 2,034 Enthusiast
    So I thought i'd post the review from Cnet for the Surface pro. http://download.cnettv.com.edgesuite.net/21923/2012/11/20/ht_NavSurface_1048.m4v
    Its receiving positive reviews and Microsoft is being very proactive. They addressed the 2 biggest issues... free harddrive space and battery life.
    http://news.yahoo.com/microsoft-defends-surface-pro-4-hour-battery-life-203043079.html
    4 hours seems short but its FULL desktop computing.
  • SimonKJones
    SimonKJones Posts: 4,448 Enthusiast
    edited February 2013
    Then there's this: http://www.engadget.com/2013/02/05/microsoft-surface-pro-review/
    Reviews are quite split, still. General impression I get is that the concept is great (as we all thought back when they announced Surface last year) but that the execution isn't quite there. The battery life would be fine if it was simply a high power gaming laptop, which is designed to be portable but always plugged in during use. But for a device that doubles up as a tablet, it seems like a much larger issue.
    That people are focusing on these issues does also suggest that Microsoft are really struggling with perception of the product, regardless of how good/bad it actually is.
  • MichaelJames
    MichaelJames Posts: 2,034 Enthusiast
    http://reviews.cnet.com/8301-3126_7-57568265/five-things-the-microsoft-surface-pro-2-needs/
    It is funny that people complain about the weight. 2 lbs isn't that bad... especially in something evenly distributed. I think the battery problem can have an easy fix by making a doc that is just a battery.
  • guitar74
    guitar74 Posts: 506
    People complain about 3 pounds my laptop weighs a lot more than that.
  • SimonKJones
    SimonKJones Posts: 4,448 Enthusiast
    Heh, you should hold our Asus power laptop that we use to demo HitFilm. It weighs more than a fricking desktop.
  • MichaelJames
    MichaelJames Posts: 2,034 Enthusiast
    Wouldn't you like a nice Surface Pro to demo HItfilm?
  • MatthiasClaflin
    MatthiasClaflin Posts: 674 Just Starting Out

    Wouldn't you like a nice Surface Pro to demo HItfilm?
    Are you offering to buy them one?
  • guitar74
    guitar74 Posts: 506

    Heh, you should hold our Asus power laptop that we use to demo HitFilm. It weighs more than a fricking desktop.
    I have to say you win. My laptop is around 10 to 14 pounds.
  • guitar74
    guitar74 Posts: 506
    The surafe pro I saw, has min requirements for HF, so it will run slow. Maye you can upgrade some parts of the computer for a special order.
  • MichaelJames
    MichaelJames Posts: 2,034 Enthusiast
    Well a lot of users use minimum or below minimum specs to run hitfilm
    http://news.cnet.com/8301-10805_3-57569066-75/surface-pro-as-a-gaming-rig-its-ready-and-able/
    Apparently people are noticing that it can handle gaming well.
  • SimonKJones
    SimonKJones Posts: 4,448 Enthusiast
    Yeah, the Surface Pro does look like it should handle HitFilm. Definitely be interesting to test it on the device.
    I've always loved the idea and concept of the Surface Pro. An easy-to-use, app-based tablet that effortlessly converts into a proper, keyboard-ready laptop with a fully functional OS is a really killer product. I'm just not sure Microsoft have done the idea justice - yet. It seems that the added hardware power in Surface Pro has put the price way up, made it heavier, reduced battery and given it noisy fans - all fine for a laptop, but a shame for a tablet.
    The main mistake they've made is making the cheaper version RT only. If the Surface RT was exactly the samea, with the lower-end hardware, but had full-on Windows 8 it would be superb. I'm not looking for a performance machine in a tablet or laptop, I just want functionality. But I'm left with the Pro, which is too expensive and flawed, and the RT which is priced very nicely but is deliberately gimped by Microsoft's absurd RT OS.
    Annoying! Full Windows 8 on a Surface RT-spec device? Now, that I'd consider.
  • MichaelJames
    MichaelJames Posts: 2,034 Enthusiast
    I am sure someone will hack the surface RT. I am sure if they do a surface pro 2 it will be much improved. I would prefer a higher speced tablet especially due to the inability to physically update anything. If it had the same specs of my computer I actually would be fine with the 4 hour battery life. Not amazing but there are accessories and things to add to the power.
  • guitar74
    guitar74 Posts: 506
    I'm still not impressed with the surface pro. Thats just me. I used a lower end laptop for HF and got tired of that mess. So, I got a better one.
  • MichaelJames
    MichaelJames Posts: 2,034 Enthusiast
    and 3d is very not impressive to me ;)
  • MichaelJames
    MichaelJames Posts: 2,034 Enthusiast
    So Cnet posted a quick breakdown of some of the complets coming out. I like the Asus ET2300INTI that is listed, especially for the discrete gtx 630m in it. Now just add a battery pack and I would be good to go.
    http://reviews.cnet.com/8301-3118_7-57570787-74/four-recommendable-windows-8-all-in-ones-under-$1300/
  • MichaelJames
    MichaelJames Posts: 2,034 Enthusiast
    So there is an opinion piece on Cnet about Microsoft getting into the PC/Complet game and that apparently the surface pro sold 400k units in a month.  That's pretty good considering a lot of people were hating on it.  The biggest knock I've seen against the Surface Pro is the battery but truthfully rarely am I using my tablet for longer then 4-5 hours on full speed settings and not being anywhere close to some place to plug in.  I mean I want more portability for sure but these things give me the full windows experience.  I could take my keyboard and mouse and a surface pro on the go with me and get a full fledged windows experience.  Its not to replace my Transformer Prime tablet... which cost me a lot of money new when it was the best thing on the market... but it really is to replace the thousand dollar laptop that people still buy.
    Impressive benchmarks of tablets and high end smart phones
    http://www.anandtech.com/show/6695/microsoft-surface-pro-review/5
  • MichaelJames
    MichaelJames Posts: 2,034 Enthusiast
    So its finally here... a tablet which is pretty powerful.  It can run Crysis 3.
    The Razor Edge Pro tablet
    rzr_edge_ctrlwtab_v11c-610x457.png
    "The Edge is a 10.1-inch Windows 8-based tablet with the internals you'd expect to find in a low- to mid-range gaming laptop. Its base configuration is priced at $999 and comes with a 1.5GHz Intel Core i5 processor, 4GB of RAM, an NVIDIA GT 640M LE (1GB), and a 64GB SSD. Bumping up to the Razer Edge Pro nets you a faster 1.9GHz quad-core Intel Core i7 processor, 8GB of RAM, the NVIDIA GT 640M LE (2GB), and either 128GB or 256GB of internal storage priced at $1,299 or $1,449. The caliber of specs are lower than the price would otherwise merit in a laptop, but the cost can be attributed to the unique form factor."
     - IGN @ http://www.ign.com/articles/2013/03/28/razer-edge-gaming-tablet-review
    Now I am not really a fan of the grips but I just realized that this table would give the control and accuracy without any additional accessories.  Now a mobile graphic card and a lower end i7 isn't going to match what's in my system but If I get the capability to buy it then I will.  Right now I have to go off to work, but it would be nice to be able to take the clips that I need to edit and greenscreen on hitfilm with me and do my work. 
  • SimonKJones
    SimonKJones Posts: 4,448 Enthusiast
    The Razer Edge is interesting but looks unwieldy - I think it'll be annoying as a tablet. Mainly, though, it just feels too expensive when that same price could get you a pretty awesome proper desktop machine.
    Personally I'm far more excited about the NVIDIA Shield, which is a full-on Android hand-held combined with PC streaming. So you get a full Android gaming device for on the move, and when at home you can stream all your PC and Steam games straight to the device for playing around the house. It can also apparently then show the video feed on your main TV, which provides a very neat way of getting your beast of a PC upstairs to run the games while you sit on your sofa playing them on your 42"+ TV.
    Assuming it works and isn't priced ridiculously, I can definitely seem myself picking one up.
  • Aculag
    Aculag Posts: 708 Just Starting Out
    edited March 2013
    The Edge looks like it would get really uncomfortable to use long term.  They give you those big handles on the side, but put the analog sticks all the way at the top?  Seems like pressing buttons would be a bit of a chore if you have to move your thumb straight down from the sticks...  Interesting concept, though, and it's pretty impressive specs for such a small device, but I definitely agree that the Shield form factor is more appealing for gaming.  Not sure about the screen on that one, though.
    Unrelated side note - MichaelJames, did you make up the term "complet", or get it from somewhere else?  I've never seen it used before, and it seems like a needless portmanteau, considering a tablet IS a computer, no matter how powerful it is.  Maybe that's just me!  :)
  • MichaelJames
    MichaelJames Posts: 2,034 Enthusiast
    I use the word Complet to describe the series of tablets which could replace home computers.  Not the 10" powerful tablets.  THe 24" super tablets that can do the full scale of PC work with the full abilities of a tablet.  Ultra books and Netbooks were needless to but someone came up with a name that worked great for marketing a specific set of features.  Netbooks and UItrabooks are just Laptops without certain features.
    Project shield looks interesting from a gaming perspective but that tablet has a different appeal for me.  Its something I can do Hitfilm on...  Hmm maybe Hitfilm 2 Express is coming to Android ;)
  • Aculag
    Aculag Posts: 708 Just Starting Out
    edited March 2013
    Gotcha.  I have to admit, those really huge Windows 8 touchscreen all-in-ones are pretty fascinating to me.  I'm not ready to ditch my mouse and keyboard just yet, but I can certainly see it happening in the future.  A large-scale touchscreen interface for audio production would be pretty great if it was precise enough that you didn't need a mouse/keyboard.
  • MichaelJames
    MichaelJames Posts: 2,034 Enthusiast
    Well with a Complet you could use your finger or a stylus.... or a wireless keyboard and mouse.  I hate onscreen keyboards.  I had brought up the idea of modifying the hitfilm interface with a mode that just makes all the buttons bigger and calling that touch mode. 
  • MichaelJames
    MichaelJames Posts: 2,034 Enthusiast
    Dell XPS 18 just got reviewed by Cnet and was rated 4 stars.  Its an 18 inch Complet that comes with a weighted stand so you can use it just like a normal desktop.  Its 5 lbs and has a 4 hour battery when off the charger and comes with 802.11n wireless and two USB 3.0 ports. the only thing this is the graphics card and  the cpu. 
    http://reviews.cnet.com/desktops/dell-xps-18/4505-3118_7-35636363.html
    I would love the Asus Transformer AiO but I don't want a large android tablet
  • SimonKJones
    SimonKJones Posts: 4,448 Enthusiast
    Interesting, though I don't really see the appeal currently of having such a massive thing on my lap. 4 hour battery life also seems a bit rubbish - and that's probably just with generic web browsing/video playing. Intensive stuff like HitFilm or games could eat into that much faster.
    I don't like the idea of an expensive, high powered tablet/computer hybrid which I can't upgrade. The main reason I'm happy to invest in a high end desktop PC is that I know I can then incrementally upgrade it over time, so long-term it's a really good value investment. With something like this it starts aging very rapidly and there's nothing you can do about it.
    It's why cheaper, lower spec but still practical tablets make a lot more sense to me at the moment. That's the main reason I'm mystified that Microsoft's offering are a low spec, crippled OS version and a super high spec, proper OS version of Surface. If they had a low/average spec but with full Windows 8, I'd be far more interested.
  • MichaelJames
    MichaelJames Posts: 2,034 Enthusiast
    @Simon... isn't a tablet something you can't upgrade... or an all in one computer?  I think this is designed to appeal to that crowd more.  Its not comparable to tablets in terms of price, but more in terms of a high spec'ed laptop.  I built my computer and love the idea that I can keep tweaking my computer.  I feel like this Complet with a 4 hour battery wouldn't let me do what I do with my tablet but it would let me have my full computing power with me in an office setting where a place to plug in is common or in class.  Its not a purchase that i'd make easily... it would be a pure luxury purchase for me.
  • SimonKJones
    SimonKJones Posts: 4,448 Enthusiast
    That's what I mean, though - I don't see the point in spending a ton of money on an expensive laptop/tablet/whatever that can't be upgraded at all. (unless you have a very specific purpose for such a thing, obviously).
    For general use, an average spec laptop/tablet/whatever that is more affordable seems to make a lot more sense. That way you can potentially buy a newer model down the line without having thrown away a ton of cash.
    For high spec stuff, investing in a progressively upgradeable machine seems to make a lot more sense, still.
    Something I'm surprised has never happened is an easily upgradeable, modular PC. Essentially that's what they are these days - changing out a GPU, for example, is literally just a matter of plugging it in. It's not like the bad ol' days where you had to consider all sorts of complicated stuff. The scary bit is taking the side of the machine off to see all the circuitry and fiddly wires. 
  • MichaelJames
    MichaelJames Posts: 2,034 Enthusiast
    I bought a Dell Venue 8 Pro... installed hitfilm ultimate and ran a quick test rendering a particle simulator.  hmm not bad.
  • MichaelJames
    MichaelJames Posts: 2,034 Enthusiast
    I brought up the idea before and i'll say it again.  There should be a easy to switch touch mode... where all it does it make buttons and things bigger.  There does not need to be any changes in functionality, just a different skin.  
    Tablets that can run a full computer's range of software are becoming common place.  For $200 bucks(got a discount) I picked up an 8" tablet that runs the regular version of windows 8 and can run Hitfilm ultimate.  There are people who have computers on here who can't do just that.  If I had the money I would get a surface pro or something with some real meat and probably do vfx and editing on the go. 
    Complets (patent pending) are growing in popularity.  I can go get a 22" all in one that works like a tablet but has the power to meet the minimum requirements for Hitfilm 2 ultimate.  Touch screen would not be great presently for some things... like adjusting tiny values for particle settings on hitfilm but the next time I spend all day flying across the country(in January at least once) I could work on a project.
    I would never want FXhome to waste time on a niche product(except for macs) or a feature that couldn't be a strong sales point.  To the professional vfx artist and compositor a touch friendly skin would seem dumb.  To the audience that hitfilm targets from someone just having fun to the indie artist I think this could be a surprisingly useful feature.
  • Triem23
    Triem23 Posts: 20,521 Ambassador
    edited December 2013
    For the record, my professional VFX and compositor friends would love touchscreen skins. Yeah, for adjusting sliders touchscreens are pretty useless, but, imagine working in a 4-window view with multitouch dragging objects around 3d space and adjusting the camera with fingers spread across multiple Windows, not having to drag the mouse pointer to the camera controls, then over to the top view, then back to front view, etc.
    I would love a touchscreen interface for my NLE, as well--again, not for fine adjustments, but for the bread and butter bits of the edit.. Sliding and positioning clips. I know one man who edits on a Wacom Cintiq with a stylus in each hand and it's neat to watch him slap a stylus on one clip to move it into position, then grabbing the next clip with the other one. That ambidextrous sonofagun is QUICK!
    Editorial comment: "Complet" is a really stupid name. Really? "Tablet Computer" is too hard to say? Is a "Complet" supposed to be better than a "tablet?" Last I checked, a tablet WAS a computer. Cpu, gpu, ram, storage, linux kernel? That's a freaking computer... With a touch screen. "Complet" looks like you just can't spell "complete." Might be a more pathetic word than "blog" or "twerk."