Blackmagic's new Camera 2.5k camera for $3000

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Comments

  • budwzr
    budwzr Website User Posts: 655
    Just another flash in the pan camera trying to be different. Doesn't even shoot 60p.
  • DanielMorgan
    DanielMorgan Website User Posts: 324 Just Starting Out
    I think you've missed the point a little bit , this cam rocks 2.5K recording in RAW formats, meaning the image won't suffer due to in-camera compression and will presumably preserve an extremely broad dynamic range. $3000 is incredibly cheap, given that it packs features that the most high-end video capable DSLRs have thus far lacked. One of the biggest complaints against cameras like the Canon 5D Mark II and Mark III is that the h.264 compression really muddies up the image.
    Trying to be Different? Don't think its trying as oppose to , it is different.
    Very Promising bit of kit.
  • StrikeEmStudios
    StrikeEmStudios Website User Posts: 224
    Flash in the pan? It offers a **** good range of features that surpass the 5D MK III's in aspects, at 3k mark do they really need to include 60p settings? they could end up making a beefier version for 5k with some higher frame-rates and more if this sells.
    Lets face it the DSLR cams have been selling in this price range really well, so don't knock it until we hear and see more.
  • budwzr
    budwzr Website User Posts: 655
    edited April 2012

    ... this cam rocks 2.5K recording in RAW formats, meaning the image won't suffer due to in-camera compression and will presumably preserve an extremely broad dynamic range....
    I wish people would be real and speak their mind in forums, and not copy/paste somebody elses opinion. I already read that and wasn't impressed.
  • budwzr
    budwzr Website User Posts: 655
    edited April 2012
    Image deleted.
  • AxelWilkinson
    AxelWilkinson Staff Administrator, Imerge Beta Tester, HitFilm Beta Tester Posts: 5,247 Staff
    edited April 2012
    If it was an opinion, I could see your point, budwzr, but considering what he was copying/pasting were facts about technical aspects of the camera in question (resolution and format), I can't really fault him for it. Especially as they are the key selling points of the camera. If he had rephrased those points into his own words, would that have implied that he agreed more with them?
    If you, as a user, require 60P in your camera, that's all well and good, and this probably isn't the camera for you. But I'm sure there are plenty of users who never use 60P on their cameras, even if it is available, so discounting the camera in general solely because of an unsupported framerate seems a bit impetuous.
    The point I find odd is that the image sensor seems to use an almost square aspect ratio, at 16.64 mm x 14.04 mm (yes, I copied and pasted those figures) I wonder if its using non-square pixels to get a standard video shape?
    Built-in Thunderbolt port, the inclusion of DaVinci Resolve (worth $1k on its own) for handling the RAW conversions, and compatibility with Canon lenses that a lot of current DSLR users are likely to have or at least be familiar with. I don't know that I'll be buying one, but its definitely a step in the right direction.
  • Aculag
    Aculag Website User Posts: 708 Just Starting Out
    Agreed, this really is a step in the right direction. I think everyone knew that DSLRs were paving the way for something great that isn't a DSLR, but it's finally starting to show.
    There's some footage on this page that looks very promising.
  • MichaelJames
    MichaelJames Website User Posts: 2,038 Enthusiast
    I look at it like this, I was going to pay 5-7 grand for a lot less features on a camera. Yea there is a lot of talk about the weird aspect ratio that is almost box like. If I can get 24p with good quality video, and excellent color reproduction I am fine with this camera. I would spend 1200 on 1-2 lens, and whatever they charge for the grip, the lcd cover and hopefully a extended battery. This may not be the go to camera for the prosumer with the financial backing to do better, but I could easily justify buying this camera with no hesitation.
  • budwzr
    budwzr Website User Posts: 655
    edited April 2012
    There's some footage on this page that looks very promising.
    Promising? What's so great about it? He's stopped down to f2, the lens is doing all the work.
    And nobody cares about higher frame rates? What about judder when panning? And no slomo?
    And BFD, it's 2500 pixels wide. That only helps if you're projecting on a wall or theatre. And anyone showing their film in a theatre is going to use real cameras.
    Broadcast is dying, network distribution is the new frontier, and 2.5K is not supported. Eats up too much bandwidth with little return.
    But I know the Apple crowd raves about anything with ProRes built in so they can finally edit straight from the camera instead of transcoding.
  • AxelWilkinson
    AxelWilkinson Staff Administrator, Imerge Beta Tester, HitFilm Beta Tester Posts: 5,247 Staff
    You discount the camera because he is using a large aperture? I don't see the connection. He is getting very high quality, sharp footage from a middle of the line lens, that seems like a good thing any way you look at it.
    I'm sure some people care about higher framerates, and some people require slow-motion capabilities. As was mentioned, if you are one of those people, then this is probably not the camera for you. But most movies don't require slow motion.
    2500 pixels wide is awesome because 1) it downsamples nicely to HD, and 2) it gives you some wiggle room in your framing, while still allowing you to crop down to full HD resolution. If you are filming things like explosions, where you can't know for certain exactly how much of the frame the effect will fill, having some overkill in the resolution is hugely useful. Its also very useful for documentary-style stuff, where the camerawork has to be reactive to what is happening.
    As far as you unreasoning and rabid hatred of Apple, you are the only one who has mentioned the ProRes support. But since you bring it up, it can't be denied that having the footage available directly in any intermediate codec is a vastly better option than the h.264 coming out of DSLR's.
  • budwzr
    budwzr Website User Posts: 655
    edited April 2012
    Your point about cropping room is the only thing that stands out, to me. Admittedly, this would make stabilizing much easier too.
    And I'll agree about the Apple hating too.:) Guilty as charged!
  • StrikeEmStudios
    StrikeEmStudios Website User Posts: 224

    But I know the Apple crowd raves about anything with ProRes built in so they can finally edit straight from the camera instead of transcoding.
    it's not only offering ProRes (which is fantastic) it also offers DNxHD out of the camera for you PC users/ abusers.
    Personally, I only ever shoot in 24p, although i do see uses in having a 50/60p option (i'd only use it for the rare few times i use slow-mo) and i assume by judder you mean rolling shutter and that can be minimised by increasing the shutter speed - not to mention we don't know enough to know if this camera will have rolling shutter issues like the DSLR cameras have.
  • AxelWilkinson
    AxelWilkinson Staff Administrator, Imerge Beta Tester, HitFilm Beta Tester Posts: 5,247 Staff
    The info on John Brawley's blog seems to indicate that it is a CMOS sensor, and that rolling shutter is comparable to the DSLR's. As he explains, at this point, it is just fundamental issue with sensors in this price range.
  • budwzr
    budwzr Website User Posts: 655
    I don't know what a PC abuser is, but I'm not going to get dragged into a PC/Mac flame war by you and Axel.:)
  • FutureisStereo
    FutureisStereo Website User Posts: 13
    Looks like an awesome camera! Cheers to BMD.
    is Hitfilm supporting any of their formats? If not yet { how soon!!! ? }
    RAW 2.5K CinemaDNG / Apple ProRes/Avid DNxHD
    thanks
  • DrewForShow
    DrewForShow Website User Posts: 1
    I'd like to see some footage from this thing. The fact that it doesn't shoot 60fps kinda sucks but, it does shoot 2k RAW.
  • Aculag
    Aculag Website User Posts: 708 Just Starting Out

    I'd like to see some footage from this thing. The fact that it doesn't shoot 60fps kinda sucks but, it does shoot 2k RAW.

    There's some footage on this page that looks very promising.
  • AxelWilkinson
    AxelWilkinson Staff Administrator, Imerge Beta Tester, HitFilm Beta Tester Posts: 5,247 Staff

    Looks like an awesome camera! Cheers to BMD.
    is Hitfilm supporting any of their formats? If not yet { how soon!!! ? }
    RAW 2.5K CinemaDNG / Apple ProRes/Avid DNxHD
    I regularly use ProRes footage in HitFilm. The camera also comes with DaVinci for color correcting/processing the raw footage, and I assume that DaVinci could export it to other compatible formats, but I don't know that for certain.
  • FutureisStereo
    FutureisStereo Website User Posts: 13
    edited April 2012

    I regularly use ProRes footage in HitFilm. The camera also comes with DaVinci for color correcting/processing the raw footage, and I assume that DaVinci could export it to other compatible formats, but I don't know that for certain.
    Sounds good. On a PC I have to try this out. I read Vegas supports prores also. Haven't tested it yet.
    Of course After Effects will likely support the adobe RAW 2.5K CinemaDNG - so you might lose some business there.
    also the avid format runs in vegas right now.
    this cams hot!
  • TomMc
    TomMc Website User Posts: 112 Just Starting Out
    Hey everyone
    Simon, Josh & I were lucky enough to grab some time with the guys from Black Magic, and they gave us a great run down on this camera. We're going to be putting a video together next week with an in-depth look at the Black Magic Cinema Camera as we think it is a really exciting development which takes DSLR style film cameras in a new direction.
    There are going to be loads of snippets of info on what caught our eye at NAB 2012, so there will be loads more to see as well...
    Tom
  • FutureisStereo
    FutureisStereo Website User Posts: 13


    There are going to be loads of snippets of info on what caught our eye at NAB 2012, so there will be loads more to see as well...
    Tom
    sound great!
  • MichaelJames
    MichaelJames Website User Posts: 2,038 Enthusiast
    Im very glad I held off on buying a camerea till now. This would be the perfect investment for my company:)
  • Andrew
    Andrew Website User Posts: 379 Enthusiast
    You're an idiot and a troll, budwzr. The fact that people in this topic are even humoring you with conversation surprises me.
    All cameras are about how you use them, not what they actually are. And at that price-point and quality, you're likely to see lots of different people utilizing the tool in many different, interesting ways.
  • budwzr
    budwzr Website User Posts: 655
    edited April 2012

    You're an idiot and a troll, budwzr.
    Because I rejected your gay advances in a private post? I have the proof.
  • MatthiasClaflin
    MatthiasClaflin Website User Posts: 674 Just Starting Out
    edited April 2012
    @Budwzr so you're a homophobe?

    Because I rejected your gay advances in a private post? I have the proof.
    Anyone could easily photoshop a picture of said proof, so that wouldn't really fly anyway
    But seriously, every camera has it's pros and cons. There is no one greatest camera and there never will be. Just the best camera for the job, and if you want slo-mo and fast frame-rates for whatever reason, then go to a different camera. If that doesn't matter to you but high quality color and large pixel count does, then it seems right for that person.
    You can't simply bash a camera for one or two things lacking. If those are important to you, then just ignore the camera. It is unnecessary to bash it because you don't like it. The lack of a 60p is a fine observation, however you can't say that this camera is therefore worthless based on this one observation.
    Bottom line- if you don't like the camera, ignore it's existence.
  • budwzr
    budwzr Website User Posts: 655
    edited April 2012

    @Budwzr so you're a homophobe?
    Not at all, just not interested. I like pretty :)

    AFA the camera, that doesn't turn me on either. 2K resolution in an otherwise unremarkable camera doesn't equal $3000.
    If it shot 720 and 1080 at 120fps or higher, I'd buy it in a minute. And it SHOULD shoot at those higher rates if it were anything but a "One Trick Pony".
    And because it doesn't, I know it has a cheapo rolling shutter, and slow capture rate. And my $3000 is better off saved for the Canon C300 in a couple years.
    Also, it's not just $3000. You've gotta buy expensive SSD memory that is useless for anything else.
    I'm going to take down my childish artwork, but I think some kind of apology is in order. I have never personally attacked anyone here, and I've wanted to many times.
  • budwzr
    budwzr Website User Posts: 655
    Anyone could easily photoshop a picture of said proof, so that wouldn't really fly anyway
    Oh, really?
  • Aculag
    Aculag Website User Posts: 708 Just Starting Out
    budwzr, you seem far more interested in riling people up than legitimately conversing about anything. If you didn't, you wouldn't have double posted, quoting the same post, six hours later.
    You've stated your opinions, and no one else seems to agree with you. Hammering the same points into the ground multiple times isn't going to change anyone's mind, so just move on. Go make another nose picking video or something.
  • Andrew
    Andrew Website User Posts: 379 Enthusiast
    I think some kind of apology is in order. I have never personally attacked anyone here, and I've wanted to many times.
    [img]http://cdn.buzznet.com/assets/users16/tctc100/default/owl-orly--large-msg-121121749799.jpg[/img]
  • TGamel
    TGamel Website User Posts: 81
    The specs for this camera look pretty cool, the fact that you can use your Canon EF lenses is a major benefit. Eventually I was looking to upgrade to a full sensor camera like the D5 Mk II, or newer D5 Mk III, but this camera may be the way to go. The fact that it will be a few years before I feel I will be ready to upgrade to such a camera gives the industry a real chance to put it through it's paces, but I must admit I like what they are doing so far.
    Todd
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